Everything about rope direction of lay

[Dubz]

Rope table according to Steel for the Royal Navy. There is no left-hand hawser laid rope listed or differentiated (or even mentioned in the Steel - I've just read all of it), which imo there certainly should be if this rope existed.

   

[Dubz]

"S" and "Z" twist describe the shape of the rope, whereas right twist and left twist describe the process used in making the rope.

   

   

Source: http://bkeithropemaker.com/Rope_Chapt_2.html

In the following picture you can see very nicely the always opposite direction of lay, i.e. even if I want to have a left-hand lay (to keep this terminology for the time being) hawser laid rope, everything has to be spun, twisted and laid in opposite directions on the levels below, ergo double the effort, double the storage, so at the moment I am still very doubtful about such a left-hand lay rope (in the epoch relevant to me at the moment).


   

Source: Art and Science of Rope, May 2018, DOI: 10.1007/978-3-319-70658-0_15-1
In book: Handbook of the Mathematics of the Arts and Sciences
Project: Book chapter: The Art and Science of Rope

Alexander Astrom and Christoffer Astrom

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"For French and British post-medieval ship’s cordage, it is proposed that we use the historical ropemaker’s terms or their foreign-language equivalents, of yarns which are spun, strands which are formed, hawsers which are laid and cables which are closed (Fig. 1)."

   
Illustration of generic post-medieval, machine-laid, cordage construction. (D. Sanders, after Tryckare, 1964: 140)

Source: Knowing the Ropes: The Need to Record Ropes and Rigging on Wreck-Sites and Some Techniques for Doing So Damien Sanders, The International Journal of Nautical Archaeology (2010) 39.1: 2–26, doi: 10.1111/j.1095-9270.2009.00235.x, S.7







cheers

Dirk

[Dubz]

A very interesting paper is the following, Harland is largely confirming that right-handed, hawser laid was "standard"

The Mariner's Mirror
http://www.tandfonline.com/loi/rmir20

The Lay of Rope, John H. Harland, Published online: 05 Feb 2014.

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Earliest ever mention of left-hand breeching rope is 1871!

Edit: Correction: 1869, A Treatise on Rope Making, Robert Chapman, S.66: "N.B.The breechings are laid left-handed or contra way Bolt-rope and breechings are made from Italian hemp." Thats all about in this book.

Definitions after Steel:

Bolt-ropes. Twenty-eight fathoms and a half of yarn make twenty fathoms of rope.

BOLT-ROPE is slack-laid, made white, and stoved and tarred by the sail-maker when used. For the merchant-service, it is generally tarred in hauls, as other rope, but sometimes as for the navy.

BOLT-ROPE. The rope sewed on the edges of sails to prevent their rending. The bolt-rope on the perpendicular or sloping edges is called the leech-rope; that at the bottom, the foot-rope; and that on the top of the sail, the head-rope.

Bolt-ropes should be stoved in a stove by the heat of a flue, and not in a baker's oven or a stovetub; and tarred in the best Stockholm tar. The flexibility of them should be always considered, in taking in the slack, which must rest on the judgment of the sail-maker.

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S.6 "Left-hand laid rope
My conclusion is that RHL predominates, not for any specific reason, but simply because ropemakers have always made it that way. In most maritime applications the lay of the rope doesn’t matter in the least, but LHL ropes were in fact produced for some purposes, starting of course with cable-laid cables, laid up by twisting three RHL ropes left-handedly, as seen in figure 1. Cables were used for the heaviest stays and shrouds and for anchor-cable. There are few detailed contemporary references to LHL, but we can offer a couple: Luce describes back-handed rope as follows:

In making the plain laid, it was said the readies (strands) were left-handed and the rope itself right-handed. If instead, the ready is given the same twist as the yarn (righthanded), when brought together and laid up, the rope must come left-handed. This is lefthand or backhanded rope. It is more pliable than plain-laid rope, less liable to kinks and grinds when new, and is allowed in the navy for reeving off lower and topsail braces.

Burney gives a similar description for cordage used with gun side-tackles: Gun Gear is hawser-laid three-stranded left-handed rope, generally termed reverselaid rope. The yarns and strands being laid up right-handed, and the rope left-handed, renders it soft and more easy to handle; for all it is not so durable, as it is more apt to admit the wet and cause it to rot.20 - Burney, Boy’s Manual of Seamanship, S.90, 1871"



   

Twining vines: the white segments show the small proportion of left-handed twists
(Courtesy Dr Will Edwards and Dr Angela Moles)

This text by Harland was now the missing piece of the puzzle for me. Left-handed breeching rope was either a cable or came much later (as "Hawser-laid left handed). If you have other sources, please share them with me :-)

cheers

Dirk

[Dubz]

I also find the following definitions interesting, according to Steel and others. And that Steel in "Art of Rigging 1818", for example, speaks of used cablets(!) for the shrouds. In my opinion, this leads to the conclusion that ships with shrouds of smaller diameter also had "cable-laid" shrouds and that therefore the impression of a left-laid rope arose, but it is actually cable-laid on the left. It seems to me a very fine but important distinction to say anything over 9 inches is a cable, anything under is a cablet.

"CABLES, ropes made of nine strands, that are nine inches and upwards in circumference."

"CABLET. Any cable-laid rope under nine inches in circumference."

cheers

Dirk

[Dubz]

I am in contact with the author of: https://www.sobco.com/ship_model/article..._rope.html, he just wrote me the following:


"I reference the Burney note in my Obsessing article but I have seen references to left handed rope earlier than 1871 - maybe as early as 1849 - see Murphy Spars & Rigging p 61

also Chapmen "Treatise on Ropemaking" 1869 - p 66

but, so far, no earlier

I fully agree, the norm for Hawser rope was right-handed with, at most, a few special cases of left handed"


A Treatise on Rope Making, 1869, Robert Chapman, S.66


"RULE.
Description of hemp and size of yarn for the various rope made.

Example.

Cables and cablets, Petersburgh .. .. 20-thread.
Hawsers and shrouds, Riga 25 ditto.
Bolt-rope, 3| upwards ditto 30 ditto.
Ditto 3 downwards ditto 40 ditto. •
Breechmg ditto 25 ditto.
White ropes ditto 25 ditto.

N.B.—The breechings are laid left-handed or contra way Bolt-rope and breechings are made from Italian hemp."


I can't find the mentioning of left handed rope in "Spars and Rigging: From Nautical Routine, 1849, John McLeod Murphy, W. N. Jeffers, S.61" though. 

cheers

Dirk

[Dubz]

And another very interesting paper!

Knowing the Ropes: The Need to Record Ropes and Rigging on Wreck-Sites and Some Techniques for Doing So

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Gun-carriage cordage
Again on Victory, below decks, all the gunbreeching-ropes are made from either left-laid or possibly reverse-laid ropes (see definitions above), as is the messenger for the anchor-cable. I have never personally found either rope-type on any wreck-site, and have not been able to discover when or where the decision to have these made specially for Victory originated. This goes back to at least the 1950s, when photographs of the quarterdeck show breeching-ropes which appear to be plain-laid (Z-twist hawser), but with S-twist ones on the main gundeck. In the mid-1990s all the gun-breeching ropes were switched to S-twist. More recently the anchor messenger-cable which in the 1950s photographs was a cable has been altered to an S-twist hawser (see earlier comments about the ability to make such ropes as hawsers in the 18th century).

I have been told, and Ashley (1993: 112) states, that backhanded or reverse-laid rope was used for gun-tackle ropes, and also hammocks, because it was less liable to tangle. Whether this is folklore, and, if not, when and how widely it was adopted, is something for archaeologists to help establish. Again, the only S-twist hawser-laid rope I have encountered is a short length found in the hull of the Newport ship. Currently both gun-tackle ropes and hammock-lines on Victory are made of hawser-laid rope. Iconographic evidence is totally unreliable. Even if the original drawing was faithful, both it and a subsequent photograph can get reversed during printing and copying processes. For example, there is a drawing from the Illustrated London News of 28 October 1876 showing one of Victory’s guns with S-twist breeching and gun-tackle rope. It has probably been reversed. Many of du Monceau’s images are either re-engraved copies, or were not cut as mirror images by the engraver. Once printed, this has turned many of his workers into left-handers, and turned S-cordage into Z.

A photograph taken on HMS Superb by Nicolaas Henneman in 1845(!!) (Science and Society Picture Library ref. 10323490), shows S-laid breeching-ropes which appear to be hawsers, not cables, around the 32-pounder guns, and Z-laid shrouds. Other Z-hawser-laid ropes in the image do indicate that in this case the print has not been reversed. An additional twist is the re-use of old rigging elements elsewhere on a vessel. John Sellar (1691: 162) states that a gunner’s stores should include old shrouds for breeching and twice-laid stuff for tackles. Add this to the probable lack of standardisation of shroud cordage discussed earlier, and it suggests that a whole range of ropetypes might be used on guns, and that the origin of the recent Victory tradition might be as simple as someone who could not distinguish a hawser from a cable lay.

We need to find gun-tackle and breeching-ropes in situ on archaeological sites. Vasa has both, and both are regular three-stranded, Z-laid rope (pers. comm. Fred Hocker). These items have also recently been found on Stirling Castle and Northumberland, wrecked during the great storm in 1703. The Stirling Castle’s breech rope is Z-laid hawser, as are the ropes associated with the tackles (McElvogue, 2008). The matter is important, because S-twist hawser-laid breeching-ropes have appeared on HMS Warrior and in association with the Hermione replica in Rochefort. If this has no historical basis, the spread of the ‘contagion’ needs to be stopped promptly, or S-twist hawsers of varying confections will be appearing all over the place, and at considerable unecessary expense.


Source: Knowing the Ropes: The Need to Record Ropes and Rigging on Wreck-Sites and Some Techniques for Doing So Damien Sanders, The International Journal of Nautical Archaeology (2010) 39.1: S.23/24
doi: 10.1111/j.1095-9270.2009.00235.x

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cheers Dirk

[Dubz]

Conclusions

• There were 3 Strand "hawser laid" ropes, these are laid right-handed.
  
• There were 4 Strand "Hawser laid" ropes with heart, these are laid right-handed and were also called "Shroud Laid".
  
• There were "Cable", these are laid from 3 or sometimes 4 Strands (see Sanders) Hawser/Shroud Laid Rope, left-handed and have a circumference of 9 inches.
  
• There were "Cablets", these are laid from 3 also sometimes from 4 Strand (see Sanders) Hawser/Shroud Laid Rope, left-handed and have a circumference of less than 9 inches.
  

• Cable originated from the necessity that at that time it was not possible to lay "Hawser Laid" ropes larger than 9 inches.
  
• Cable & Cablets are weaker than "Hawser Laid" but less sensitive to weather.
  
• According to Sanders, Cable & Cablets were not always wormed, often simply served (presumably when protection was needed against hawser fillets).
  

• Ropes were laid to different degrees (slack-laid) according to the area of application.
  

• There is no evidence that left-hand "Hawser Laid" ropes were common or used in shipping before about 1830 in any way.
  
• Left-hand running rigging on (contemporary) models is wrong (this is where all my research started, as I had noticed this with many Russians and also a SuperAmi, who all lay their own ropes).
  

• Consequently, there is also no convincing evidence that left-hand breeching rope existed BEFORE about 1830 as hawser-laid rope.
  

• It should be kept in mind that from about 1849 onwards, Americans equate "Hawser laid" and "Cable"!
  

• As Sanders writes in his paper "Knowing the Ropes: The Need to Record Ropes and Rigging on Wreck-Sites and Some Techniques for Doing So" it is incredibly important to stick to existing terminology as there have been and are major misunderstandings (he writes this in 2010(!)).
  

• With old photos & engravings, always make sure they are not mirrored images (which Sanders says happens).
  

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cheers

Dirk

[Dubz]

Yesterday I researched further into the subject of right-hand laid "Hawser-Laid", i.e. the "standard" cordage, especially for running rigging. It is frightening how many models are falsely left-hand layed, especially the Russians, even the champions get it wrong. It also happens with many (restored(?)) museum models, too. This is a real plague (Sanders has also stressed this problem in his great paper, p.24: "The matter is important, because S-twist hawser-laid breeching-ropes have appeared on HMS Warrior and in association with the Hermione replica in Rochefort.If this has no historical basis, the spread of the 'contagion' needs to be stopped promptly, or S-twist hawsers of varying confections will be appearing all over the place, and at considerable uneccessary expense.").

I have found several old pictures on Master Korabel's VK page that a) clearly show hawser-laid on the right, but also show some nice pictures of right- but also left-laid breeching rope, but well out of "my" time line, so around, as already pointed out, the middle of the 19th century.



Running rigging and shrouds "Hawser-Laid", right-handed.





Running rigging also "Hawser-Laid", right-handed here.





Running rigging and breeching rope "Hawser-Laid", right-handed, shrouds also as it seems.





Running rigging "Hawser-Laid", right-handed.





Running rigging and breeching rope "Hawser-Laid", right-handed.





Running rigging and breeching rope "Hawser-Laid", right-handed.





Running rigging and shrouds "Hawser-Laid", right-handed.





Running rigging and shrouds "Hawser-Laid", right-handed. Russian frigate, Osliaba, ca. 1863.





Running rigging and shrouds "Hawser-Laid", right-handed. Breeching rope left-handed. Russian frigate, Osliaba, ca. 1863





By the way, here you can also see the hoists for fresh air. Russian frigate, Osliaba, ca. 1863 in the harbour of New York





Running rigging "Hawser-Laid", right-handed.





Running rigging "Hawser-Laid", right-handed. Breeching rope left-handed.




Edit: Another image..

Running rigging and breeching rope "Hawser-Laid", right-handed. USS Tuscarota, 1863-65



cheers

Dirk

[Dubz]

Bad Examples

   

Cite: "8 strands on each hook and 4 strand."

It's somehow scary how less people who offer rope in their online shops knows about rope. There is usually no need to offer S-Laid (left-handed) Hawser. 

Doing a Cable right handed with this strand combination shows this guy knows nothing about rope directions and the principles of laying rope. A cable is per definition [see above] S-laid (left handed) made from three right-handed hawser laid strands. This rope above is plain wrong. But people buy it. What a pity.

[Dubz]

Sources
Chronological sorted

1794, David Steel, The Elements and Practice of Rigging and Seamanship

1796, David Steel, Art of Rigging – 2nd edition

1808, Darcy Lever, The young sea officer's sheet anchor

1843, John Fitcham, A Treatise on Masting Ships and Mast Making

1848, George Biddlecombe, The Art of Rigging

1849, Murphy & Jeffers, Spars and Rigging

1852, William Brady, The Kedge Anchor (1847)

1853, Kipping, Rudimentary Treatise on Masting, Mast-Making, and Rigging of Ships

1862, George. S. Nares, Seamanship

1864, Ainsley, The Examiner in Seamanship

1869, Robert Chapman, A Treatise on Rope making

1869, Charles Chapman, All About Ships

1871, Burney, The Boy’s Manual of Seamanship & Gunnery

1871, Ulffers, Handbuch der Seemannschaft

1891, Luce, Textbook of Seamanship

1917, A. Hyatt Verrill, Knots, Splices and Rope Work: A Practical Treatise

1921, Kipping, Rudimentary Treatise on Masting, Mast-Making, and Rigging of Ships

1927, Anderson, Rigging of Ships in the Days of the Sprit Topmast

1944, Ashley’s book of Knots

1968, Eichhoff, Die Sprache des niederdeutschen Reepschlagerhandwerks

2000, Petersson, Rigging Period Ship Models

2007, Corder, la-belle rigging in the days of the spritsail topmast, Master Thesis

2007, Petersson, Rigging Period fore and aft Craft

2009, Damien Sanders, Knowing the Ropes, Paper

2011, Bohr & Olsen, The ancient art of lying rope, Paper

2012, HMS Colossus, Monitoring and investigation 2012, Project Report

2014, Harland, The lay of rope, Journal Article

2015, HMS Colossus, Investigation 2015, Project Report

2016, Astrom, Mathematical and physical properties of rope made for decorative purposes, Paper

2018, Astrom, Art and science of rope, Paper

2019, Damien Sanders, The Cables and Cablets of the Mary Rose (1545), Paper

2021, Scott Bradner, Obsessing about rope